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averagewaistdude
Advanced Contributer
United Kingdom
7373 Posts |
 Posted - 09/03/2012 : 11:08:03
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I am depping for a swing jazz band I sued to play with a few years back. I have a 20" Paiste 505 Greenlabel and 22" Dream Bliss. Not that suitable for Jazz/Swing I believe.
Let me have your recommendations. Budget: 100 sheets |
OmNomNomNomNomNomNomNomNomNomNom
In order to make an apple pie from scratch, you must first create the universe
"There is a theory which states that if ever anybody discovers exactly what the Universe is for and why it is here, it will instantly disappear and be replaced by something even more bizarre and inexplicable. There is another theory which states that this has already happened."
-- Douglas Adams |
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jamoca
Advanced Contributer
United Kingdom
12485 Posts |
Posted - 09/03/2012 : 11:15:20
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I use my 22" Dream Bliss as one of my rides for small quartet gigs so it should work fine, certainly for depping!
I use it as the heavier of my 2 main jazz rides, alongside it I use my 21" Bosphorus Master ride which is beautiful and smoky. If you can stretch your budget, I would recommend this along with the Istanbul Agop SE Jazz Tony Williams rides, and Bosphorus Master Vintage rides.
If not, maybe try a Vintage Bliss in a smaller size or you might find a 2nd hand Sabian HH/HHX Manhattan. A lot of jazz drummers I know like the Zildjian K Custom Dry ride - in my opinion a step too far! |
Edible Goody Consumption Officer and Parallel Parking Specialist of the forum's Sonor Delite appreciation society
Personal roistering assistant to Mr Bob Dobalina and (nearly) undisputed Curry King |
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brushbaby
Advanced Contributer
United Kingdom
643 Posts |
Posted - 09/03/2012 : 11:22:02
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| Istanbul 21" Mel Lewis ride (Agop) or 21" Istanbul Mehmet Legend ride, I am reliably informed they are the same model and that Mehmet actually made all Mel's cymbals before the split, you may get one S/H for that money, lovely cymbal plenty of depth and just enough wash. |
old drums, old cymbals |
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averagewaistdude
Advanced Contributer
United Kingdom
7373 Posts |
Posted - 09/03/2012 : 11:25:05
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| I find the Dream Bliss a bit too washy. Not too bad with a nylon tip but with a wooden it roars! |
OmNomNomNomNomNomNomNomNomNomNom
In order to make an apple pie from scratch, you must first create the universe
"There is a theory which states that if ever anybody discovers exactly what the Universe is for and why it is here, it will instantly disappear and be replaced by something even more bizarre and inexplicable. There is another theory which states that this has already happened."
-- Douglas Adams |
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logic_user99
Advanced Contributer
United Kingdom
10126 Posts |
Posted - 09/03/2012 : 12:58:46
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My 20" Bliss C/R is a little too washy for all-around jazz use, IMO. I've taken - until I can get a Zildjian 'Left Side' ride - to using my 18" Remix ride as my main jazzer. Paired with the 18" Bliss there is enough contrast to make it work for low-level gigs.
I'd love one of the Bosphorous Master Vintage/Turk pies. Sexy beast. |
Drums | Cymbals | Sticks
"Starting my professional life from scratch..." |
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jazzclubnice
Very Active Contributer
United Kingdom
119 Posts |
Posted - 09/03/2012 : 18:20:57
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| Sabian Manhattan Jazz for me. Totally controllable, but opens up when needed. Sounds great with brushes and has a bell that really stands out. You might be able to find a second hand for around £100. |
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Chris Gravestock
Advanced Contributer
United Kingdom
399 Posts |
Posted - 09/03/2012 : 22:10:07
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| Paiste 602 flat ride. Expensive, but unbelievably gorgeous sound. I've done Istanbuls and vintage Ks, but nothing compares to the 602! |
Canopus Club, Paiste 602 and, occasionally, a cocktail kit. |
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Dave S
Advanced Contributer
United Kingdom
5359 Posts |
Posted - 09/03/2012 : 23:57:14
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I would go for something that is reasonably dark and on the dry side if it's going to be your main ride - maybe something reasonably crashable. The AA Raw Ride is an amazing all round jazz cymbal, failing that try some Istanbuls (possibly Turks or Special Dry).
Personally I use a K Custom Dry Light ride as my main right side ride (I used to use a Breakbeat, like logic_user99) with a 20" Dream Bliss Crash/Ride as my second right side - the first is a little too dry for most people, but I like it. The Dream is ok, but a bit washy and I'm looking to replace that at some point... |
davesmyth.co.uk | soundcloud | facebook | twitter |
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steveh
Advanced Contributer
Australia
5049 Posts |
Posted - 12/03/2012 : 08:05:38
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quote:
Originally posted by Chris Gravestock
Paiste 602 flat ride. Expensive, but unbelievably gorgeous sound. I've done Istanbuls and vintage Ks, but nothing compares to the 602!
Yep Chris is correct, I have had one since 1972 (Red Label)20" and I still get guys asking, "you still got that ride" >>?? |
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crafty
Advanced Contributer
United Kingdom
7748 Posts |
Posted - 12/03/2012 : 09:19:33
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The Bliss should get you through anything on the Jazz side. You can dry it out by running a 6+ inch length of gaffa from the edge of the bell down to the bow. I tend to use my Sabian Duo ride in tandem with the Bliss for certain things but generally, the Bliss covers it all - Big Band to small group, piano trio and vocalist stuff. You just have to play the Bliss a bit more in certain zones to get dryer and washier tones. Also if you run use a chain, it controls the wash beautifully.
Ed |
Super cool - and bongos too!
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Allegro
Advanced Contributer
United Kingdom
1524 Posts |
Posted - 12/03/2012 : 09:49:42
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| I use the 20" Sabian Evolution Ride or the 18" Sabian HH Crash/Ride. |
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averagewaistdude
Advanced Contributer
United Kingdom
7373 Posts |
Posted - 12/03/2012 : 11:48:16
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| Hi Ed - gaffa on the outside (striking side) or the underneath (I am such a noob) |
OmNomNomNomNomNomNomNomNomNomNom
In order to make an apple pie from scratch, you must first create the universe
"There is a theory which states that if ever anybody discovers exactly what the Universe is for and why it is here, it will instantly disappear and be replaced by something even more bizarre and inexplicable. There is another theory which states that this has already happened."
-- Douglas Adams |
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crafty
Advanced Contributer
United Kingdom
7748 Posts |
Posted - 12/03/2012 : 12:38:08
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Underneath. Also, you can cancel out unwanted frequencies by gently putting your fingertip on the back of the cymbal and moving it around the suface until the frenquency drops out. Then apply a small amount of gaffa to that spot. I remember having an old K Jazz ride that whined a perfect sine wave (like a high whistle) and a spot of gaffa made it playable again. Shouldn't have dropped it in the first place.
Ed |
Super cool - and bongos too!
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averagewaistdude
Advanced Contributer
United Kingdom
7373 Posts |
Posted - 12/03/2012 : 12:40:03
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| Ta much |
OmNomNomNomNomNomNomNomNomNomNom
In order to make an apple pie from scratch, you must first create the universe
"There is a theory which states that if ever anybody discovers exactly what the Universe is for and why it is here, it will instantly disappear and be replaced by something even more bizarre and inexplicable. There is another theory which states that this has already happened."
-- Douglas Adams |
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gezz
Excellent Contributer
United Kingdom
160 Posts |
Posted - 09/06/2012 : 22:46:50
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| for jazz I have a Paiste Signature Flat ride with 4 rivets and a 19" Istanbul Agop Special Edition Jazz Ride which is totally staggering!! these two together are just beautiful |
A Custom lover!!! |
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monkeythedrummer
Advanced Contributer
United Kingdom
9183 Posts |
Posted - 10/06/2012 : 10:50:11
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How large is the band?
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100% NOT SELLING Yamaha DTXplorer Module, 5x ddrum triggers, mesh heads and Yamaha E-cymbals. |
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TimSharp
Advanced Contributer
United Kingdom
469 Posts |
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dogface
Advanced Contributer
United Kingdom
891 Posts |
Posted - 11/06/2012 : 11:05:24
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This kind of question baffles me. Why not get the cymbals you like, not what other people on a forum like?
You have two choices:
1) go into a shop and try what they have to see what suits you, or
2) buy something online that you have never heard, purely on the recommendation of someone you have never met.
It's got to be option 1 for me. |
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Bazarre
Advanced Contributer
United Kingdom
7983 Posts |
Posted - 11/06/2012 : 12:06:46
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Vint 22" Super Zyn but not the later five star version |
Sex, magic and R n R! -- all in ZOLIN! now on Amazon for Kindle readers |
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Dave S
Advanced Contributer
United Kingdom
5359 Posts |
Posted - 11/06/2012 : 12:14:11
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quote:
Originally posted by dogface
This kind of question baffles me. Why not get the cymbals you like, not what other people on a forum like?
You have two choices:
1) go into a shop and try what they have to see what suits you, or
2) buy something online that you have never heard, purely on the recommendation of someone you have never met.
It's got to be option 1 for me.
I think the point is that a lot of shops don't have a vast range of cymbals to try, let alone 'jazz' cymbals. Why not ask the opinion of other instrumentalists? It can provide a pretty handy starting point to finding a ride that you like.
I've always tended to buy cymbals second hand for several reasons, not least that if I don't like them I can usually sell them on for not much of a loss, as well as shop floors not being the best acoustic to hear cymbals. |
davesmyth.co.uk | soundcloud | facebook | twitter |
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Captain Bubble
Advanced Contributer
United Kingdom
14612 Posts |
Posted - 11/06/2012 : 13:08:44
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quote:
Originally posted by averagewaistdude
I am depping for a swing jazz band I sued to play with a few years back.
That's a fine way to ensure you get the gig!
Blu-Tack instead of Gaffa? Less mucky perhaps? Might try it. |
Marcus de Mowbray
www.330studios.co.uk/marcus |
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dogface
Advanced Contributer
United Kingdom
891 Posts |
Posted - 11/06/2012 : 13:44:00
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quote:
Originally posted by Dave S
quote:
Originally posted by dogface
This kind of question baffles me. Why not get the cymbals you like, not what other people on a forum like?
You have two choices:
1) go into a shop and try what they have to see what suits you, or
2) buy something online that you have never heard, purely on the recommendation of someone you have never met.
It's got to be option 1 for me.
I think the point is that a lot of shops don't have a vast range of cymbals to try, let alone 'jazz' cymbals. Why not ask the opinion of other instrumentalists? It can provide a pretty handy starting point to finding a ride that you like.
I've always tended to buy cymbals second hand for several reasons, not least that if I don't like them I can usually sell them on for not much of a loss, as well as shop floors not being the best acoustic to hear cymbals.
I suppose I'm fortunate enough to live 15 minutes away from the Manchester Drum Center where they have hundreds of cymbals to choose from. The problem with that shop is that the choice is so huge it can be overwhelming. Quite a lot of the cymbals in there wouldn't suit me at all (nothing wrong with them, just mot my cup of tea) and I'd be pretty miffed if I'd bought one online based on a recommendation. I have bought two cymbals in the past without hearing them first and I've learned my lesson - never again.
I bought a beautiful UFiP from MDC and I wouldn't have got that anywhere else at that price so I'm glad I went in the shop. |
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JKDrummerDude
Excellent Contributer
United Kingdom
269 Posts |
Posted - 11/06/2012 : 13:53:35
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| If nothing else, reading up on others opinions on cymbals can help you make a more informed choice when you go to play stuff in a shop. At least it can help you take some of the wider range cymbals out of your way when you're after a particular sound. |
Yamaha Tour Custom 24, 12, 13, 16, 18, C&C Maple 22, 12,14,16 Yamaha DTXPress IV Special |
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Dave S
Advanced Contributer
United Kingdom
5359 Posts |
Posted - 11/06/2012 : 13:58:11
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quote:
Originally posted by dogface
I suppose I'm fortunate enough to live 15 minutes away from the Manchester Drum Center where they have hundreds of cymbals to choose from. The problem with that shop is that the choice is so huge it can be overwhelming. Quite a lot of the cymbals in there wouldn't suit me at all (nothing wrong with them, just mot my cup of tea) and I'd be pretty miffed if I'd bought one online based on a recommendation. I have bought two cymbals in the past without hearing them first and I've learned my lesson - never again.
I bought a beautiful UFiP from MDC and I wouldn't have got that anywhere else at that price so I'm glad I went in the shop.
Yeah, that's fair enough! The way I tend to do it is to buy second hand online and not pay any more than I think I can sell it on for, check out as many clips to make sure the cymbal's probably in the right ballpark area soundwise and then see when I get it - if I don't like it, I'll flog it. I find this works as I get to properly test the cymbal and decide before committing to parting with the cash (if that makes sense).
I was recently in the market for some new hats and I was shocked by how few shops had a decent range of cymbals in stock to try, but that's another story. |
davesmyth.co.uk | soundcloud | facebook | twitter |
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jon kelly
Advanced Contributer
United Kingdom
471 Posts |
Posted - 11/06/2012 : 21:54:17
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a great jazz ride is the Dream Bliss 24 inch small bell flat ride i should know its sweet.quote:
Originally posted by averagewaistdude
I am depping for a swing jazz band I sued to play with a few years back. I have a 20" Paiste 505 Greenlabel and 22" Dream Bliss. Not that suitable for Jazz/Swing I believe.
Let me have your recommendations. Budget: 100 sheets
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JK |
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MacDB7
Excellent Contributer
United Kingdom
254 Posts |
Posted - 15/06/2012 : 16:12:36
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Just keep your eyes out on eBay to buy an older cymbal for very little money in comparison to what they are new.
I have a couple of 20" Zildjian K rides that I use, an 20" Istanbul Mel Lewis sig which I use as a left-side ride rather than my primary, a couple of riveted rides including an 18" Zildjian Armand 'Beautiful Baby' plus a number of older unknown rides which were bargains I picked up from eBay.
Hope that helps a little. |
Jazz drummer
Mapex & Zildjian = the perfect combination!
http://soundcloud.com/calum-macleod |
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wibblylad
Advanced Contributer
United Kingdom
1209 Posts |
Posted - 19/06/2012 : 19:31:14
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I think the K Custom Dark is a good all round cymbal - good stick definition, crashable and dark-ish.
Mega bucks....
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Wanted:
Yamaha 9000RC 16" Floor Tom in 'Deep Aqua'
Here's Hoping..... |
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Tobba
Very Active Contributer
Norway
116 Posts |
Posted - 22/06/2012 : 09:23:02
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| My call for jazz gigs are 22"Paiste Twenty Light Ride or 22" 602 Pre-serial Thin. |
PREMIER all the way
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Jon Petersen
Advanced Contributer
Denmark
1768 Posts |
Posted - 22/06/2012 : 18:26:37
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quote:
Originally posted by steveh
Yep Chris is correct, I have had one since 1972 (Red Label)20" and I still get guys asking, "you still got that ride" >>??
Red Label? Then it is a 2002, not a 602. B8, not B20.
Jon |
I TRY to tell myself I already have what I want..... |
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Glide
Advanced Contributer
808 Posts |
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