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MarkMooch
Advanced Contributer
United Kingdom
1409 Posts |
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Dave S
Advanced Contributer
United Kingdom
5359 Posts |
 Posted - 08/08/2012 : 14:10:44
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| I think that's a reasonable price - you see 16/17" second hand K Custom crashes going for the £135-145 mark. I paid c.£190 for my Dry Light Ride which I thought was a fair price. I guess it depends how common they are on the second hand market and how desperate you are to sell it, too. |
davesmyth.co.uk | soundcloud | facebook | twitter |
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Prog
Advanced Contributer
United Kingdom
21169 Posts |
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jamoca
Advanced Contributer
United Kingdom
12486 Posts |
Posted - 08/08/2012 : 14:15:57
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quote:
Originally posted by Prog
I'm sure Flurbs will be along soon to explain.
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Edible Goody Consumption Officer and Parallel Parking Specialist of the forum's Sonor Delite appreciation society
Personal roistering assistant to Mr Bob Dobalina and (nearly) undisputed Curry King |
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flurbs
Advanced Contributer
United Kingdom
4893 Posts |
Posted - 08/08/2012 : 14:22:22
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quote:
Originally posted by MarkMooch
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=300753740416&ssPageName=ADME:B:SS:GB:1123#ht_824wt_1070
I've just sold mine for £160 privately which I thought was fair as they are £300 new nowadays, but £200 for a second hand ride, really!? Seems a rip to me, anyone else agree?
Usually if a seller is running an "or best offer" listing it means they aren't expecting to get the BIN price, and that further information can be found in the details...
FWIW, I run my pricing that 2/3 of the new price is about right for the starting offer on an as-new/VCG cymbal, which is what this is. If it gathers dust, then the price will be lowered, but in reality all it takes is one drummer who wants it and considers it to be a fair value in exchange for the product and service, especially if it's backed up by images and a videofile of the actual cymbal so they can be assured of what they're getting (believe me - unless it's a non-B20 Meinl or Paiste, they DO all sound different). However if you don't agree, you are welcome to make a lower offer, or free to take the chance on a cheaper/private/non-videofiled sale.
If you don't believe that a 2nd hand ride cymbal can be worth £200, at least two of my customers have disagreed with you this morning. I regularly see premium ride cymbals selling close-to and above the £200 mark on Ebay. (Zildjian K's, K Customs, K Cons, Paiste Dark Energy, Trads and 602's, Sabian HH, HHX's...) If you want a cheaper ride, I do offer them too! |
VideoFile Cymbal Shop at www.2ndchancecymbals.co.uk |
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flurbs
Advanced Contributer
United Kingdom
4893 Posts |
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MarkMooch
Advanced Contributer
United Kingdom
1409 Posts |
Posted - 08/08/2012 : 14:51:35
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quote:
Originally posted by flurbs
PS - thanks for the ad!
Ya cheeky bugger! |
Drummer & Educator in N.E. England.
www.MarkRichardsonDrums.com
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MarkMooch
Advanced Contributer
United Kingdom
1409 Posts |
Posted - 08/08/2012 : 15:37:29
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quote:
Originally posted by flurbs
quote:
Originally posted by MarkMooch
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=300753740416&ssPageName=ADME:B:SS:GB:1123#ht_824wt_1070
I've just sold mine for £160 privately which I thought was fair as they are £300 new nowadays, but £200 for a second hand ride, really!? Seems a rip to me, anyone else agree?
Usually if a seller is running an "or best offer" listing it means they aren't expecting to get the BIN price, and that further information can be found in the details...
FWIW, I run my pricing that 2/3 of the new price is about right for the starting offer on an as-new/VCG cymbal, which is what this is. If it gathers dust, then the price will be lowered, but in reality all it takes is one drummer who wants it and considers it to be a fair value in exchange for the product and service, especially if it's backed up by images and a videofile of the actual cymbal so they can be assured of what they're getting (believe me - unless it's a non-B20 Meinl or Paiste, they DO all sound different). However if you don't agree, you are welcome to make a lower offer, or free to take the chance on a cheaper/private/non-videofiled sale.
If you don't believe that a 2nd hand ride cymbal can be worth £200, at least two of my customers have disagreed with you this morning. I regularly see premium ride cymbals selling close-to and above the £200 mark on Ebay. (Zildjian K's, K Customs, K Cons, Paiste Dark Energy, Trads and 602's, Sabian HH, HHX's...) If you want a cheaper ride, I do offer them too!
I was initially taken aback after having just sold the same model cymbal for £160 (roughly what it cost me 2nd hand a few years back) via a gum-tree ad to then come across the same model cymbal on ebay for £50 more the next day, especially having failed for a while to sell it via the Buy & Sell Drums group on Facebook.
I can believe someone COULD pay that for the cymbal depending on the circumstances (service, convenience, security etc) although whether I would usually pay a premium for that is another matter.
However I now appreciate that this £50 more isn't necessarily £50 more after having overlooked the 'Best Offer' function and of course not forgetting the £20+ it will cost you to list the cymbal on bay.
The question for me now is should I have done the same as you and created a great listing on ebay, with a video and sold it that way, or could the person I sold the cymbal to theoretically go and do that now to make a profit.
As for same model cymbals sounding different, I believe you as I have experienced this myself, it comes down to a few things like manufacturing process, grime building up over the years and how a cymbal may have been handled etc.
However it is funny when not using the eyes drummers, band members, audience member can't always tell which cymbal is which or not notice if it has been changed from that last gig for example. Zildjian only have one recording of each cymbal model on their website, not a recording for each cymbal that comes out of the factory which is inevitably different, neither do they state the cymbal you buy will not necessary sound exactly the same as the sound clip you are listening to.
I do however think people know what they like. . . a couple of years back I went in to a drum shop, tried some hats out liked them and came back to buy them later but they had been sold, the pair they ordered in for me was not the same and I didn't like them as much.
Another thing I know from hearing music in the recording studio, then having it mastered and finally uploading it to You Tube is that the sound changes a little bit with compression (and mysteriously EQ) so of course that neither is a 100% reflection of the cymbals sounds even BEFORE it gets to the listeners speakers.
The good thing about gum-tree is you can supply good pictures (and link or upload a video), and the buyer can actually physically meet the seller and see / hear the actual cymbal for themselves, albeit only viable within their local area which is why one might struggle to find a buyer just like on a small Facebook group.
Worth noting is that it seems Zildjian cymbals have gone up in price a few times over the last few years which will also affect the 2nd hand value too, so I'm glad at least I got my money back and it is fortunate that the K Ride I want is not as expensive as the K Custom Hybrid.
So what would your lowest price you could afford to take on the cymbal be?
You have a nice listing and it seems like a nice service, although I like many drummers hate parting with more money than necessary although I do like to support my local drum shops.
This is interesting actually. |
Drummer & Educator in N.E. England.
www.MarkRichardsonDrums.com
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flurbs
Advanced Contributer
United Kingdom
4893 Posts |
Posted - 08/08/2012 : 16:02:39
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quote:
Originally posted by MarkMooch
. . . a couple of years back I went in to a drum shop, tried some hats out liked them and came back to buy them later but they had been sold, the pair they ordered in for me was not the same and I didn't like them as much...
Yes - one cymbal in particular I regret not keeping was a 1st-issue K Custom Medium Ride which I had in a shop when they first came out. It was an astonishing sounding pie, but I thought, well, I can always pick one up... I've had about 1/2 a dozen through my hands since and they've just not been as good. Lesson learned.
quote:
Originally posted by MarkMooch
Another thing I know from hearing music in the recording studio, then having it mastered and finally uploading it to You Tube is that the sound changes a little bit with compression (and mysteriously EQ) so of course that neither is a 100% reflection of the cymbals sounds even BEFORE it gets to the listeners speakers.
This is true, but I think that most people realise it. My goal is to get as good a representation as possible. It's impossible to counteract what Youtube does to a clip, but I ensure that before it gets to that stage that it is a high quality, neutral, dynamic and uncompressed recording of the cymbal at ear-distance.
quote:
Originally posted by MarkMooch
Worth noting is that it seems Zildjian cymbals have gone up in price a few times over the last few years which will also affect the 2nd hand value too, so I'm glad at least I got my money back and it is fortunate that the K Ride I want is not as expensive as the K Custom Hybrid.
May I ask which K ride it is that you are after?
quote:
Originally posted by MarkMooch
So what would your lowest price you could afford to take on the cymbal be?
In the interests of NBOSOTF, you can check the "real" price on my website. Sure, the 'same' cymbal could be had for less on a private-sale, and I'm never going to try and convince anyone otherwise. There's no such thing as the lowest price - you'll ALWAYS find someone selling something cheaper if you look hard enough and wait long enough. Someone prepared to do so, and take the risk of buying unheard for the lowest possible price, will never be a customer of mine and I'm happy to accept that. My customer base is the upper-spending half of 2nd hand buyers and the lower-spending half of new buyers. The person who buys the ride in question will, in all likelihood, not have been looking for a 2nd hand cymbal, they'll have been looking for it new...
quote:
Originally posted by MarkMooch
You have a nice listing and it seems like a nice service...
Thank you. Have you seen the rest of the website? (It's linked in the Ebay listing, or click the homepage icon beside my username).
quote:
Originally posted by MarkMooch
...although I like many drummers hate parting with more money than necessary although I do like to support my local drum shops.
I am nothing if not a local drum shop! We're all in the same boat - customers will either like what I'm offering at the price I'm offering it at - or they won't. Part of the reason 2nd Chance Cymbals now exists is because I saw that people were paying MORE for 2nd hand cymbals with LESS info, both private sales and from other local drum shops. |
VideoFile Cymbal Shop at www.2ndchancecymbals.co.uk |
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MarkMooch
Advanced Contributer
United Kingdom
1409 Posts |
Posted - 09/08/2012 : 15:31:47
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quote:
Originally posted by flurbs
quote:
Originally posted by MarkMooch
. . . a couple of years back I went in to a drum shop, tried some hats out liked them and came back to buy them later but they had been sold, the pair they ordered in for me was not the same and I didn't like them as much...
Yes - one cymbal in particular I regret not keeping was a 1st-issue K Custom Medium Ride which I had in a shop when they first came out. It was an astonishing sounding pie, but I thought, well, I can always pick one up... I've had about 1/2 a dozen through my hands since and they've just not been as good. Lesson learned.
quote:
Originally posted by MarkMooch
Another thing I know from hearing music in the recording studio, then having it mastered and finally uploading it to You Tube is that the sound changes a little bit with compression (and mysteriously EQ) so of course that neither is a 100% reflection of the cymbals sounds even BEFORE it gets to the listeners speakers.
This is true, but I think that most people realise it. My goal is to get as good a representation as possible. It's impossible to counteract what Youtube does to a clip, but I ensure that before it gets to that stage that it is a high quality, neutral, dynamic and uncompressed recording of the cymbal at ear-distance.
quote:
Originally posted by MarkMooch
Worth noting is that it seems Zildjian cymbals have gone up in price a few times over the last few years which will also affect the 2nd hand value too, so I'm glad at least I got my money back and it is fortunate that the K Ride I want is not as expensive as the K Custom Hybrid.
May I ask which K ride it is that you are after?
quote:
Originally posted by MarkMooch
So what would your lowest price you could afford to take on the cymbal be?
In the interests of NBOSOTF, you can check the "real" price on my website. Sure, the 'same' cymbal could be had for less on a private-sale, and I'm never going to try and convince anyone otherwise. There's no such thing as the lowest price - you'll ALWAYS find someone selling something cheaper if you look hard enough and wait long enough. Someone prepared to do so, and take the risk of buying unheard for the lowest possible price, will never be a customer of mine and I'm happy to accept that. My customer base is the upper-spending half of 2nd hand buyers and the lower-spending half of new buyers. The person who buys the ride in question will, in all likelihood, not have been looking for a 2nd hand cymbal, they'll have been looking for it new...
quote:
Originally posted by MarkMooch
You have a nice listing and it seems like a nice service...
Thank you. Have you seen the rest of the website? (It's linked in the Ebay listing, or click the homepage icon beside my username).
quote:
Originally posted by MarkMooch
...although I like many drummers hate parting with more money than necessary although I do like to support my local drum shops.
I am nothing if not a local drum shop! We're all in the same boat - customers will either like what I'm offering at the price I'm offering it at - or they won't. Part of the reason 2nd Chance Cymbals now exists is because I saw that people were paying MORE for 2nd hand cymbals with LESS info, both private sales and from other local drum shops.
Thanks for the info Simon, in heindsight I should have put my cymbal on ebay to give you a bit of competition and myself a bit more money ;-). Although the guy who bought it off me is a friend of a friend who is going to use it for his pub band and seems really happy with it, so I'm happy for him
I think I'm going to go for a plain old 20" K as having seen them played by other drummers as well as playing one myself they sound spot on for what I need which is pop, rock, funk and even a little swing. I would need to play/hear one again though.
Incidentally I also have a K light ride and it is really lovely, ideal for jazz or blues but has too much wash to be my main all rounder. The one thing I really liked about the K Custom Hybrid was it's bell, it was killer, perhaps too killer but I always like a good bell on my ride cymbals. |
Drummer & Educator in N.E. England.
www.MarkRichardsonDrums.com
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Spart
Advanced Contributer
648 Posts |
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MarkMooch
Advanced Contributer
United Kingdom
1409 Posts |
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